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Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

Angela, being beaten down by white supremacy is not the same as blaming white people. It's pointing blame at white supremacy, there is a difference, white supremacy as I understand it is the faction/culture/history of specific groups and individuals who are white effecting policies, programs, laws, institutions, and social public opinion to favor only people who are also white while ignoring, brutalizing, or restricting those who are not white. For instance rudolf Julianis stop and frisk policy which targeted and profiled people of color as potential criminals simply because they were not white. That was a white supremacists action. No, white people all over are not to blame for that. However by being white I/we/you dont often see white privilege because i/we/you are not disenfranchised by it. Being disenfranchised because of skin color results in people of color having to seek sanctuary from such forces that in effect ignore, restrict, and brutalize people simply for being who they are.

Posted by Soen on 12/03/2016 at 11:06 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

"Bhatt and Butler wanted to emphasize in their interviews with the Express that the local underground music scene isnt to blame...They also said that these non-permitted residences that host underground shows are often the only safe place for marginalized people, those who find above-the-board and sanctioned venues unsafe or inhospitable. 'We need spaces that are open to folks who are beaten down and oppressed by living daily under patriarchy and white supremacy,' Butler said."

Posted by Angela Talbot on 12/03/2016 at 10:32 PM
Posted by Carrie Paulson on 12/03/2016 at 10:29 PM

Re: “'I Genuinely Thought I Was Going To Die': Reddit User Describes Terrifying Escape From Oakland Warehouse Fire

I think the reason artists in the Bay Area live in "death traps" such as this is because rents are unreasonably high. And the reason they perform and party in "death traps" such as this is because there aren't many economical venues to perform in (if you play underground music).

For some of us, these scenes, that support unusual music, art, and creativity, represent the epitome of why we want to live in the Bay Area.

This is a tragedy. But shutting down artist space is not going to solve the fundamental problem - high rent - limited support for the Arts. If we want to keep the Bay Area underground Arts scenes viable, we need to publicly support housing and performance space for musicians, artists, and other creative types to do their work.

Posted by Eric Glick Rieman on 12/03/2016 at 10:15 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

I'm trying figure where in this story did it particularly say it was white people fault?

Posted by DP 1 on 12/03/2016 at 10:07 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

Wrong Nick. The location was kept secret until the day of. From the Facebook page: SECRET EAST OAKLAND LOCATION
ANNOUNCED DAY OF SHOW.

Posted by Angela Talbot on 12/03/2016 at 9:36 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

Angela you are a disgusting hateful woman. You should be embarrassed of your shameful ignorance.

Posted by 510love on 12/03/2016 at 9:33 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

Interesting how white people are to blame for the actions of *greedy* morons who organize and promote 'underground' events in death traps. Some people are just incapable of accepting responsibility for their own stupidity.

Posted by Angela Talbot on 12/03/2016 at 9:22 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

Lynn... This party was not a secret. Its location has been public for weeks. Please consider that maybe you don't know the whole story before you lecture us about our own motivations.

Posted by Nick S. on 12/03/2016 at 9:16 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

Hold up. It's not just being forced into marginalized space because of the real estate sitch. These alt spaces have allure for underground parties and always have. They allow for alot of off-the-radar stuff to happen. Isn't that (partly) why the locations are not posted until the last minute??? Not like you are trying to rent "legit" space, like maybe the community room at the Y, right... or a bunch of others I could list, right? There are plenty of reasons you are hitting the back streets...

Posted by Lynn Rogers on 12/03/2016 at 8:59 PM

Re: “'I Genuinely Thought I Was Going To Die': Reddit User Describes Terrifying Escape From Oakland Warehouse Fire

I have been going to and even helped throw dozens of "warehouse" parties in SF & Oakland since the late 1980's. Underground culture has been my lifeblood longer than most of these fire victims have been alive. While I have no direct experience attending events at the Ghost Ship space in Fruitvale, I have observed it for years from the sidewalk and wondered what the hell was happening there. I writhe in pain at thought of the pointless deaths that occured, and the demise of so many young creative souls, yet harbor I harbor no illusions that those involved must escape the legal consequences they set themselves up for in enabling and enticing customers to this Fruitvale Death Trap. This was not just an accident of fate, but a preventable catastrophe. Our society, while ostensibly opposed to fascism, discrimination or unecessaary government intrusions, must recognize public safety as a primary and unavoidable reality when celebrating its freedoms and diversity. To invite your comrades to die enmass in order to pay your rent does not make you a cultural hero. I mourn for the victims and those that dod not consider what they were participating in, as this was not just an accident, but a conspiracy.

Posted by lil mike on 12/03/2016 at 8:36 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

This tragedy makes me ache for the artists in the Bay Area and in other cities around this country as this event will have broad repercussions. But in particular I worry about how young creative people are to survive in the Bay Area. How can they possibly pay the exorbitant rents for established and safe studios or gathering spaces? The Bay Area will become a duller and poorer place if the young musicians and artists cannot afford to live here.

Posted by Melissa Gwyn on 12/03/2016 at 8:02 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

Bruce

Two of my friends have likely died.

I have decades of experience on this matter. It is nuanced, conplicated and deeply effects not only the socisl fabric ofbthe bay area, but even the world.

Your words are as ignorant as they are heartless and dangerous.

You are the vangaurd for the unthinking mob. I wager none of my words will likely sway your position, given the lack of forethought apparent in your comment. May you experience in your life something that may pierce your lack of empathy and your dangerous ignorance on this matter.

Posted by Eugene Steele on 12/03/2016 at 7:48 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

Clearly Bruce you have no understanding of what they are referring to as safety. They aren't talking about fire or other building related dangers. They are talking about a place where they are safe from persecution as minorities. Check your privilege.

Posted by Aurora on 12/03/2016 at 7:43 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

Your lack of sympathy is cruel and your laying blame even in a vague way is absolutely not what our or any community needs right now you Idiot. Crawl back into whatever dark hole you came from. No one here wants your smug preaching about consequences.

Posted by vanessa abel on 12/03/2016 at 7:16 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

bruce ferrel. could you possibly be any less sensitive ?
jesus christ . is it absolutely necessary for you to comment negative bullshit ?
there are possibly up to 40 dead people . have some decency ,and shut your troll ass up .
I know its hard , but im assuming youre an adult.. think you can manage ?
or must you mock people who are in deep mourning at any chance you get ,so you can prove how intellectually "superior" you are?
youre a dink

Posted by Jay p Lindy on 12/03/2016 at 7:15 PM

Re: “Artists at Last Night's Oakland Warehouse Fire Discuss The Tragedy, Those Missing, Need for Safe Underground Spaces

"non-permitted residences that host underground shows are often the only safe place... " Wait... safe?! Who will ask the dead how "safe" it was?

a lot of us owe their politics and their musicianship to [Casio]. He emboldens people to break rules. Like fire regulations

" ...Had the potential to be incredible" and was actually risky and deadly. The bottom line; No matter how creative you are, how innovative, The choice to operate outside of the establishment carries possible consequences up to and including death.

The grim reaper isn't racist, isn't gender-ist and doesn't gentrify. He/She/It don't care about any of that or your intentions.

Construct a fire trap, there is an excellent chance of people dying. No matter how "cool the vibe is", the result isn't cool, supportive or nurturing. It's just dead with a lot of people left behind to grieve.

0 likes, 1 dislike
Posted by Bruce Ferrell on 12/03/2016 at 6:33 PM

Re: “Oakland Warehouse Fire: 'It Was A Tinderbox. I Don't Recollect Anybody Coming Out.'

Garry, were you there? Ever been there, no? STFU then

Posted by Crispin Mccabe on 12/03/2016 at 4:00 PM

Re: “Oakland Warehouse Fire: 'It Was A Tinderbox. I Don't Recollect Anybody Coming Out.'

Kids, plus rave, plus cigarette. plus piles of junk= disaster.

Posted by Garry Ovalbach on 12/03/2016 at 3:45 PM

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